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uk-1
27-04-2007, 09:37 PM
do you think there is still a place for smaller shows?

it seems that lots of fighters now want the money from the bigger shows that is just not there from a 4/500 crowd.

for me smaller shows seem to have a different feel, don't get me wrong i love the big shows to but it seems to me that every man in the crowd see's himself fighting at a smaller event.

if fighters go on demanding higher purses will the grass roots shows go?

Big Bri
29-04-2007, 05:42 AM
What do you class as a higher purse?
I think if the fighter can generate alot of money from ticket sales he should get a decent share of it, if he just turns up and has only sold 5 tickets though he should be paid accordingly.
Local shows need local fighters, they are the life blood of those events.
Everybody enjoys watching their mates fight, the card could of been boring up to that point for them but in the morning once the beer has worn off all they`ll remember is the fight their mate had and how cool it was.
Not some complete stranger`s fight even if skill wise it was better than their mates.
Without local fighters I`d be suprised if most shows even break even.

Engine
30-04-2007, 07:29 AM
I see the problem as being with the fighters. Many of them have visions of grandeur, they see them selves as professional fighters and worthy of the money that goes with it. Yet most fighters are still amateur or semi pro at best. This is even on the big shows.

Seriously, how many of the top UK fighters are genuine pro fighters, with pro skills. I could upset a lot of people here, but I won't.

If you look at 80% of the pro boxers in the UK, they fight on small 500 seaters, most never even get past that. Only 20% ever get past that level. In MMA, for some reason, we are the other was around on the 80/20 rule. 80% of MMA fighters get their fights on the UK main brands, cagewarriors, cage rage, etc. It is crazy, but I doubt it will change, it is one of the inherent problems of this sport.

woo
30-04-2007, 01:14 PM
There is definately still a place for smaller shows. At the end of the day that's where it all started and how talent is discovered.

I enjoy going to both mainstream events and the local, more raw shows. The fights can be just as entertaining, sometimes moreso.

As popular as mma has become it's still extremely hard to make it into a career. The amount of lads and lasses that train nowadays is ever growing and it's great that the smaller events allow them to showcase their skills. It's unfortunate that some fighters are starting to 'demand' higher purses, especially if their abilities don't match the demands.
If the smaller shows start disappearing I think it will have a knock-on effect on the the amount of people getting into the sport.

There seem to be lots of smaller shows popping up now and I think that's an indication that they are very important in the growth of mma.

Nak-Muay
30-04-2007, 02:39 PM
I think if the fighter can generate alot of money from ticket sales he should get a decent share of it, if he just turns up and has only sold 5 tickets though he should be paid accordingly.

Agreed! I have about 15 - 20 people hopefully coming with me to my fight... ;)

nomad
30-04-2007, 03:55 PM
I think that the smaller shows will always stay for the local fighters as experience but I'm guessing that will be it (sadly).
purses are pretty frikn low anyway for most fighters, so to take smaller shows after some fight experience is kicking yourself in the foot.
I'd love to fight in my hometown but if I'm getting paid bugger all, there's no way it's happening. I have to at least meet my training expenses each time around or else I'm paying to fight, and I promised I wouldn't do that.

I think the smaller shows will be local established shows.
New shows that are small will be succesfull in the short term to introduce fans to the sport, but once they discover higher quality bigger shows, that'll be it.

It's all theory of course.

uk-1
30-04-2007, 04:58 PM
thats why i give 25% on all tickets and tables fighters sell. but for some they are just so greedy and self important the think that the should earn more than everyone else, to the extent of demanding more than cr contenders purses ect. its simple if fighters want to fight, just do it. the big money will come. i also give a fair purse, if you are local and have many fans at 50 a table and 5 per ticket you can make good money.

Big Bri
30-04-2007, 10:10 PM
Agreed! I have about 15 - 20 people hopefully coming with me to my fight... ;)


What if you were generating 100+ worth of ticket sales,and those people wouldn`t be going to the show unless you were fighting.
You are therefore generating that income yourself off of your own back.
What would you expect then?
All fighters should get a decent ticket deal,other wise what`s the point of selling any tickets at all.
Training for a fight from my point of veiw means cutting down on overtime ect for the training up to the fight, by the time fight day comes around I`m well out of pocket just getting there.
Getting a small share of the income I generate doesn`t seem fair to me.
You say 15/20 people are coming to watch you,would you think it unfair if your opponent was getting a higher purse than you if he was selling 100+ tickets?

iandean
30-04-2007, 11:11 PM
What if you were generating 100+ worth of ticket sales,and those people wouldn`t be going to the show unless you were fighting.
You are therefore generating that income yourself off of your own back.
What would you expect then?
All fighters should get a decent ticket deal,other wise what`s the point of selling any tickets at all.
Training for a fight from my point of veiw means cutting down on overtime ect for the training up to the fight, by the time fight day comes around I`m well out of pocket just getting there.
Getting a small share of the income I generate doesn`t seem fair to me.
You say 15/20 people are coming to watch you,would you think it unfair if your opponent was getting a higher purse than you if he was selling 100+ tickets?

My advice would be if you don't like what promoters are giving you.

1. Do your own show. Then you will find out how hard it is, especally if you do it properly and end up truly out of pocket.

2. Get a decent manager who will hopefully sort you out a decent purse

3. Or realise that NO ONE in MMA gets what they truly deserve unless they are lucky and/or work hard and pay their dues. Or think of some gimmack which a promoter likes and hopefully they will pay you loads.

marc goddard
30-04-2007, 11:36 PM
[QUOTE=Engine;28956]I see the problem as being with the fighters. Many of them have visions of grandeur, they see them selves as professional fighters and worthy of the money that goes with it. Yet most fighters are still amateur or semi pro at best. This is even on the big shows.QUOTE]

never a truer word spoken. now that is a fucken statement and a half.

i am in a fortunate position that with my show i can pay for the fighters efforts in selling tickets, and when i say pay i mean pay. i do genuinely feel like bigbri says if you are selling a shed load of tickets you deserve the reward.

but like kainer said all shows dont have the same associated set up costs, fighters wages, hotels, production......i could go on all day.

like i said engine pretty much has got it down.....

Big Bri
01-05-2007, 05:56 AM
My advice would be if you don't like what promoters are giving you.

1. Do your own show. Then you will find out how hard it is, especally if you do it properly and end up truly out of pocket.

2. Get a decent manager who will hopefully sort you out a decent purse

3. Or realise that NO ONE in MMA gets what they truly deserve unless they are lucky and/or work hard and pay their dues. Or think of some gimmack which a promoter likes and hopefully they will pay you loads.

I`ve done 2 of those and who knows soon it could be all 3:D

TheKeyboardGonzagaKick
01-05-2007, 08:40 AM
when the promoters on here are talking about ticket deals do you also give the fighter a base level purse guarantee as well (regardless of how small it is)?

On a slightly different tangent regarding fighter pay; how much opportunity for purse progression is their on the smaller show level? Obviously a debut fighter should be being paid less than the headliners (ticket deals aside) but what is the difference? Say a young fighter debuts on a small show and go 5, maybe 10 fight undefeated, all exciting wars, KO's or Subs and thus becomes the promotions headliner. I am sure in that case the guy would be selling more tickets himself so his pay would go up in that repsect but I assume he would be attracting punters that he himself didn't sell tickets to (either to see the new star shine or to see him get KTFO). Will his base purse go up accordingly and if so by how much? I mean by like doube or treble etc, not an actual number just would there be a big increase?.....Or...would said fighter only get into the main event spot if he could seel enough tickets himself, does his record really count?

What I am getting at is where does the line lie whereby it becomes necessary for a fighter to move on to a new, probably bigger, promotion? If the fighter has been on a tear and recorded an impressive record with good performances surely the bigger, 'national' level promotions would be interested in them and thus that presents a chance to get a bigger payday. So how much would a main eventer on a small show make compared to a lower or midcard fighter on a big show?

I know I have rambled on and I know that in reality thee is far more factors invloved than what I have laid out but I hope you get my basic question(s). Sorry for the 20 Qs but I genuinley am interested in the bhind the scenes stuff, unless you are actually involved in a card (either on the promotions or teh fighters end) you don't really hear about this stuff as a fan so if any promoters/fighters could discuss this that would be great thanks.


Anyway back to the original post;
I can't understand why smaller shows would be in decline, everyone has to start somewhere and what with the sports recent growth I would assume there are more debutant fighters than ever before as well as an increased audience who want to see an MMA show live. I know that the 'mainstream' fans can be fickle and uneducated but on the upside I am guessing that a load of pisshead chavs also don't care too much about who is fighting as long as they are seeing a 'good' fight. I guess the real threat to small shows are the feeder events (like CR: Contenders, and to a certain extent CW - although I don't consider them small as such - with their links abroad) where debut fighters all want to get onto as they have a clear track of progression and promotion to big leagues and therefore the bigger paychecks. Anyone know if the UFC has tried to work with any domestic events overhere?

Naruto
06-05-2007, 01:03 AM
The physical size of the show just reflects the immediate environment.
Small show is a broad term. If the promotor is stingy and do absolute minimum just to run a show then all he'll get in return is just a show.

A pro fighter is worth how ever much he agrees to.
Its the fighters responsibility (well managers in most cases) to have his fights which will help him progress in respect to the fight purse.

For me its a case of timing. If a promotor comes to me at short notice, I would expect a higher purse then if i went up to him and asked him if he has any fights in the short space of time.
For a show ive booked well in advance it means im not allowed to fight up to a month before so i would expect a much higher purse :)

Ive taken fights which i would have missed if i'd squabbled over the cash.
and declined fights where i just werent prepared to accept anything less.
Promotors are just referencing the start up cost anyhow, they retain rights to make up from dvd sales which is limitless.
As awareness increases so does the sales of dvd's and budget for the next show.

Its also about how the promotor stretches the !
If he overspends on a big name or two he'll squeeze it out of the lesser known fighters.
Good luck to all up and coming promotions :D

The Treatment
11-05-2007, 09:39 PM
LOL at making up the dosh on DVD sales.

Unfortunately the reality of that is the promoter spends an unneccessary fortune on a great production, half the fighters buy a copy and half don't, and their mates copy it.
The promoter then sits with 50% of the copies stuck up his ass and a fortune down on the filming - every time. Nice thought though.

Everyone just needs to be a bit straighter. I think this thread cropped up before in a similar vein.
This generation of fighters will not see the benefit of MMA's growth. Your legacy will be to strengthen the foundation for the future. Attempts to out price yourself working on the assumption that you are "worth more" will kill the small show.
As stated before, you probably are worth more but the money is not there at that level. You can only earn money by generating it and that means ticket sales. Quite frankly if at least one fighter in a contest aint selling a ticket, the contest is not needed, It's taking up valuble space for another that does sell tickets. The bottom line is that tight on a small show.
If you can see where the money is going in the production, you know that the promoter is not lining his pockets at your expense. Quite the opposite in fact. If there are big screens, flashing lights, nice vip tables, good facilities etc etc the promotion is giving you a blueprint to progress, and it's a good reason to support it.
Will the promoter earn more money than you? probably and so he should, he has put more money in and taken more financial risk. That said I have come out of plenty of shows with less than the best ticket sellers - just not anymore. And no one offers me a fiver to help out when i'm ten grand down!
There are fighters that will earn more than you in the future and there are promoters who will be more succesful than me - and that will be down to both of us.

All we have to do is decide if it's worth it or not. If it's not then jack it and don't look to blame anyone else.
;)

theassasin
11-05-2007, 10:30 PM
the above is the voice of a very good promoter too

marc goddard
11-05-2007, 11:43 PM
LOL at making up the dosh on DVD sales.

Unfortunately the reality of that is the promoter spends an unneccessary fortune on a great production, half the fighters buy a copy and half don't, and their mates copy it.
The promoter then sits with 50% of the copies stuck up his ass and a fortune down on the filming - every time. Nice thought though.

Everyone just needs to be a bit straighter. I think this thread cropped up before in a similar vein.
This generation of fighters will not see the benefit of MMA's growth. Your legacy will be to strengthen the foundation for the future. Attempts to out price yourself working on the assumption that you are "worth more" will kill the small show.
As stated before, you probably are worth more but the money is not there at that level. You can only earn money by generating it and that means ticket sales. Quite frankly if at least one fighter in a contest aint selling a ticket, the contest is not needed, It's taking up valuble space for another that does sell tickets. The bottom line is that tight on a small show.
If you can see where the money is going in the production, you know that the promoter is not lining his pockets at your expense. Quite the opposite in fact. If there are big screens, flashing lights, nice vip tables, good facilities etc etc the promotion is giving you a blueprint to progress, and it's a good reason to support it.
Will the promoter earn more money than you? probably and so he should, he has put more money in and taken more financial risk. That said I have come out of plenty of shows with less than the best ticket sellers - just not anymore. And no one offers me a fiver to help out when i'm ten grand down!
There are fighters that will earn more than you in the future and there are promoters who will be more succesful than me - and that will be down to both of us.

All we have to do is decide if it's worth it or not. If it's not then jack it and don't look to blame anyone else.
;)

good post.

Boom Boom
11-05-2007, 11:59 PM
Again LOL at:
"Promotors are just referencing the start up cost anyhow, they retain rights to make up from dvd sales which is limitless.
As awareness increases so does the sales of dvd's and budget for the next show."

But what is the copyright & DVD's sales worth at present?
There's a constant steam of posts on here about "look at fight X on youtube" before the DVD is even released!
or
"does any one know where I can download/stream fight X from?"

It's no wonder the promoters struggle to make a return on the production cost.
I think I should stick to filming lovely ladies, every bugger wants to buy those DVD's (joke)

Big Bri
12-05-2007, 05:43 AM
Attempts to out price yourself working on the assumption that you are "worth more" will kill the small show.
As stated before, you probably are worth more but the money is not there at that level. You can only earn money by generating it and that means ticket sales. Quite frankly if at least one fighter in a contest aint selling a ticket, the contest is not needed, It's taking up valuble space for another that does sell tickets. The bottom line is that tight on a small show.
If you can see where the money is going in the production, you know that the promoter is not lining his pockets at your expense. Quite the opposite in fact. If there are big screens, flashing lights, nice vip tables, good facilities etc etc the promotion is giving you a blueprint to progress, and it's a good reason to support it.
Will the promoter earn more money than you? probably and so he should, he has put more money in and taken more financial risk. That said I have come out of plenty of shows with less than the best ticket sellers - just not anymore. And no one offers me a fiver to help out when i'm ten grand down!
There are fighters that will earn more than you in the future and there are promoters who will be more succesful than me - and that will be down to both of us.
;)

I agree with the above totally Karl, but out of interest if I was selling say 10 tables and another 60ish tickets,what purse would you offer?
I don`t begrudge the promoter making money,after all as you say he`s risking his own hard earned cash putting the show on but sometimes people sell 10 tickets and get the same as a guy who sells 100 because it`s a "small show".
That doesn`t seem fair to me?

iandean
12-05-2007, 10:55 AM
I think it also depends Brian on how many fights you had and how good of a fighter you are and the level of your opponent.

Big Bri
12-05-2007, 12:11 PM
Maybe,but I`d still be intereseted in the answer,Bournemouth isn`t far from me;) ?

die hard
12-05-2007, 01:05 PM
Without the "smaller" show there would be nowhere for the fighters to show off there skills and move up in the world of mma, by saying "smaller" i think each and every show is as importent as the next one because who knows the next chuck or vitor could come from one of them?.

biganddaft
14-05-2007, 09:22 PM
I think if your fighting for money your fighting for the wrong reason.

Big Bri
14-05-2007, 10:01 PM
I think if your fighting for money your fighting for the wrong reason.

You obviously don`t have kids and a morgage then?
It`s about being paid for what you do,by the time I`ve cut my overtime down to train for a fight I`m 500+ down.
If you still live at home with your parents the money probably doesn`t matter but if you have to weigh up your family`s needs against your hobby it`d be nice to break even.

iandean
15-05-2007, 03:30 AM
You obviously don`t have kids and a morgage then?
It`s about being paid for what you do,by the time I`ve cut my overtime down to train for a fight I`m 500+ down.
If you still live at home with your parents the money probably doesn`t matter but if you have to weigh up your family`s needs against your hobby it`d be nice to break even.

I live at home with my parents but it certainly would be nice to break even for the work that you do.

Don't think for one second mate that everyone behind the scenes makes money, cos if you do you might be surprised. But that don't stop some of us from trying to push the guys that bring it inside the cage/ring and try to progress their careers the right way

Big Bri
15-05-2007, 06:17 AM
I don`t doubt not everyone makes money but that`s not why I posted,at the end of the day you have to make sure your own interests are being taken care of.

The Treatment
15-05-2007, 10:23 AM
Bri
The answer to your question is several fold.
As mentioned, the level of fight will affect the basic wage.
It is true that if two fighters are the same level they may well get the same money. The extra bunce is in the work you do on tickets. Thats where the reward comes from. It's unlikely that you will be rewarded with an additional hike in the basic purse because you worked harder on the tickets.
In a sales environment (which is what this subject is really) basic wages are standard to motivate the person to sell and earn commission. Sounds a bit harsh but if a fighter is not selling himnself in every way, he/she is going nowhere.

The upside for you, if you are doing what you say you are (hyperthetically speaking) is that the promoter will want you on the show.
The guy who sells ten tickets but earns the same wage will only be needed if it suits and there is another ticket seller to match him against where as your career might be nurtured a little better, building your profile thus putting you in a better position all round for any event in the future.
Don't forget that I could spend time an money building your profile for ten fights which would suit both of us, but as soon as UFC call, becuase of what I have done, you will be off. My work is done and I have to start again. I will never see anything that comes from the next level that I helped to get you too, so my bunce is in the early work (all hyperthetically speaking of course).
I have no problem with that scenario.

The other small point is this. If you are an ass ache, it probably does not matter how good you are, promoters will lose interest. Standing your ground if you are being treated badly is one thing, making a noise to try to enhance your importance is something else (i refer to no one in particular by the way).

Finally, by way of clarification, this thread is about smaller shows which I would class as up to about 1000. Much of the above is aimed at the 500-1000market place while some of it would apply to any show considered a feeder.
Also my comments are aimed primarily at fighters within a ticket selling radius of the promotion. It would be unrealistic to bring a great fighter from Manchester to Bournemouth and expect sales. However, I would probably match him with someone who did sell. All smaller promotions do and will continue to rely on regional sales to survive. So please don't squeeze too much.

Oh yes, sorry to waffle - Bri - if you are relying on this game to support your family (or provide the extras), It won't happen at regional level. However, work in unity to build your profile (good for you, good for the small time promoter) and your next Cage Rage visit might be directed more at you and your success, with a longer lasting deal. You are big and ugly and might be just what they need :D

Big Bri
15-05-2007, 05:06 PM
Bri
The answer to your question is several fold.
As mentioned, the level of fight will affect the basic wage.
It is true that if two fighters are the same level they may well get the same money. The extra bunce is in the work you do on tickets. Thats where the reward comes from. It's unlikely that you will be rewarded with an additional hike in the basic purse because you worked harder on the tickets.
In a sales environment (which is what this subject is really) basic wages are standard to motivate the person to sell and earn commission. Sounds a bit harsh but if a fighter is not selling himnself in every way, he/she is going nowhere.

The upside for you, if you are doing what you say you are (hyperthetically speaking) is that the promoter will want you on the show.
The guy who sells ten tickets but earns the same wage will only be needed if it suits and there is another ticket seller to match him against where as your career might be nurtured a little better, building your profile thus putting you in a better position all round for any event in the future.
Don't forget that I could spend time an money building your profile for ten fights which would suit both of us, but as soon as UFC call, becuase of what I have done, you will be off. My work is done and I have to start again. I will never see anything that comes from the next level that I helped to get you too, so my bunce is in the early work (all hyperthetically speaking of course).
I have no problem with that scenario.

The other small point is this. If you are an ass ache, it probably does not matter how good you are, promoters will lose interest. Standing your ground if you are being treated badly is one thing, making a noise to try to enhance your importance is something else (i refer to no one in particular by the way).

Finally, by way of clarification, this thread is about smaller shows which I would class as up to about 1000. Much of the above is aimed at the 500-1000market place while some of it would apply to any show considered a feeder.
Also my comments are aimed primarily at fighters within a ticket selling radius of the promotion. It would be unrealistic to bring a great fighter from Manchester to Bournemouth and expect sales. However, I would probably match him with someone who did sell. All smaller promotions do and will continue to rely on regional sales to survive. So please don't squeeze too much.

Oh yes, sorry to waffle - Bri - if you are relying on this game to support your family (or provide the extras), It won't happen at regional level. However, work in unity to build your profile (good for you, good for the small time promoter) and your next Cage Rage visit might be directed more at you and your success, with a longer lasting deal. You are big and ugly and might be just what they need :D


Quality post,cheers for the reply Karl.

The Treatment
16-05-2007, 11:52 PM
You are welcome Bri.
If I may just add to the reality of it all (following a PM or 2 that came my way), a ticket seller is someone who can do 40+ every time. A good ticket seller does double that or more. A must have is 100+. 10-15-20 is what my mum does if i give her a weeks notice to fight.

Also 25% is very generous from Darrin considering the capacity of the venue.
20% makes more business sense and if anyone is arguing about his rates you best weigh it up and think again.

I am forever hearing about what every other fucker pays but not one single fighter ever comes up with a like for like comparison. Arsenal pay more than Brentford therefore Cage Rage pays more than UK1 (sometimes).
UK1 and Brentford give you a platform to the premiership, so don't kill them!

iandean
17-05-2007, 12:00 AM
Good words...don't bite the hand that feeds you. And it works both ways, as the decent UK promotions do work hard for little reward and do their best to promote their fighters, I know i'm constantly looking for "big fights" on big shows aboard for my guys and i think it is the same with any show that cares about the long term aspirations of their fighters.

A fighter needs the uk scene to progress and the UK scene needs the fighters. It's a 50/50 relationship and it works best when both sides work together things to get done.

However you have to deal with the facts that in the UK scene there is still not the money about to pay huge monies and if you see the payroll for WEC, UFC, KOTC i think it does back-up the status quo.

If you can sell a lot of tickets then that's great news for both sides but i personally resent it if a fighter used ticket sales to try and hold the promotion over a barrel (and demand more money and/or "big" fights) as long term it could backfire on them.

The Treatment
17-05-2007, 12:41 AM
"Long Term" Kainer?
If people in any walk of life can't see the bigger picture, they will only damage what you are trying to achieve.

The fighter that tries to hold you over a barrel is viewed the same as a promoter who pays nothing and spends nothing on the promotion and future development whilst lining his own pockets. One is treated with contempt by fighters and one by promoters. However, there is good and reasonable in both parties and we should be moving in the same direction.
I earn more because I risk more and spend more. Don't begrudge me that.
Good fighters, you are respected and revered more because you put your nuts on the line physically. Everyone wants to be you, not me.

I do good numbers every show yet when I go to my after show party (that i finance) and jump the queue to get in (coz its my party), some people think I am taking a liberty. But if a fighter from the billl does the same, they all want to shake his hand. I am getting paid but not recognised, the fighter is getting recognised, to get paid better in the future.Blah di blah, it's the path we all choose and I don't begrudge you your status.

iandean
17-05-2007, 12:55 AM
I'm not 100% sure if you think i was having a dig at you, as i wasnt.

However you should count yourself lucky you even have an aftershow lol

At CW they keep me workinging till the early hours of the morning :)

The Treatment
17-05-2007, 01:13 AM
Far from it my friend, I think I was re-inforcing your point.
The aftershow? Have to have it. It's where everyone gets to be Billy Big Bollockz for a few hours when I am already about 6 hours past my bed time and people are asking me why I am there and who I am!!!!

It's all part of the master plan (alledgedly)!:p

iandean
17-05-2007, 01:18 AM
lol

ten letters

nomad
17-05-2007, 11:31 AM
I went to Intense fighting last weekend to watch Tsunami and CFF fight.
I looked around and thought, it's barely even full, it's in a shitty part of town and it could have sold more.
But that said, the fights were fantastic.
Smaller shows are here to stay, you get great fight quality for much less money and where else can you see the stars before they are big shots?

shakus maximus
17-05-2007, 11:03 PM
i think that smaller shows will always be around as every fighter needs a starting point.

with reference to pay every sport in the world is the same. you have to progress. if after a few fights you show that you are a decent fighter and that you will sell tickets then the rewards will come.

the problem is some guys expect money from their first fight on which just aint gonna happen.

when david beckam signed for man utd he was on 45 quid a week for the first two years. he never went to the manager and said i want this amount or that amount cos one day i will be one of the best in the world.. the guy has just had a 130 million dollar contract given him. this is down to progessing in your chosen sport and starting at the bottom of the ladder and working your way up.

lots of the best fighters in this country started off fighting for nothing to get their foot on the ladder and gain experience, ie galsic, alex owen, jenkins(who would still fight for fuck all) goddard, mann, the list is endless.

some guys in mma will never earn a large purse as they are not good enough but they continue to fight as it is their chosen sport and they enjoy it. no different to the millions playing football in the sunday leagues around the world.

just my thoughts on a good topic

regards shaky

The Treatment
17-05-2007, 11:24 PM
Good realistic post Shaky

RKing85
18-05-2007, 12:25 AM
There will always be room for smaller shows. Sure the attendence might suck and the fighter's purses will be small, but it's where young fighters gain experience so the bigger shows can be as good as they are.

FNG
18-05-2007, 05:50 PM
As long as poeple feel they are getting value for money then the shows will prosper. Hopefully in time MMA will go the way of Friday night boxing.

uk-1
18-05-2007, 09:30 PM
all will be well,

just if guys keep there feet on the ground and do not be greedy! some people think thats what promoters are about? i think maybe they are judgeing by there own standards.