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Crash
27-09-2007, 10:43 AM
I've just come off a cycle of maximuscle cyclone (That I now realise is hugely unpopular on here.) Personally I think I had a good results with it. I met all of my goals for the summer in weight gain and increases in lifts. However that was luxury, I had a full-time job then and blew a little extra cash on reaching my targets. Now I'm going back to being a full-time bum (student) and I don't have that luxury.

From reading these boards the two brands that stand out to me as both being reasonably priced with good reviews are reflex and myprotein. I have a few queries to the guys that recommend these products.

Which specific "version" of myprotein would you recommend?
The list of protein powders is slightly overwhelming. Sticking to whey the impact whey isolate, seems to be the best value using the sites own xg of protein per 100g of powder statistics.

How does the myprotein taste with no flavourings or sweetners?
From a health side, I'm thinking this would be better? then say reflex with the added sugars and flavourings? Is this likely to actually make any noticable difference in my performance? I mean is this insignificant... if its going to be a reasonable gain, I will try to stomach the flavourless, non sweet gunk.

Finally a more general whey powder question. Is it ok to pre-mix protein shakes?
I travely alot for my mma/bjj training so tend to take a shake after training. If I were to go with the flavourless stuff I might start blending it with a bannana and some oats to get some real flavour into it. This would mean mixing the drink upto 3-4 hours before consuming it. Does the protein lose its effectiveness? Like, say, creatine would?

My aims from now until the new year, are to maintain weight and improve my cardio. My intentions with the protein is to take it after mma/bjj training, cardio sessions and weights to maintain my weight -Any opinions on this, either product or the queries above are greatly appreciated.

Sam,

LewisJ
27-09-2007, 11:35 AM
Which specific "version" of myprotein would you recommend

That depends on your budget. Guys I know that use it go for the cheaper concentrates (they are also students) and have had good results. There are however obvious questions about the quality/ purity of the powders when they are at such low prices. You make your own mind up.


How does the myprotein taste with no flavourings or sweetners?

Absolutely fine, not really any flavour at all when mixed with water. Worth noting that there is some good research out there showing that adding carbohydrate to your protein will improve amino acid uptake into muscle cells. You can get dextrose powder (either from myprotein/ local chemist) adding this to the flavourless powder makes it actually taste nice. Just depends whether you can afford the extra colories. As for the sweetners and performance I would say that they would have no effect on performance.


Is it ok to pre-mix protein shakes?

I would say yes, but its just as easy to put the powder in your shaker and then add water after training. Also if you can stomach it your better off taking the shake strait before training, again this increase amino acid uptake compared to after training.

Sports-Select.co.uk
27-09-2007, 12:28 PM
My 2 Cents:

Reflex over My Protein

Concentrate over Isolate

If you are going to leave a shake keep it refrigerated or at least cooled.

Alex Gold
27-09-2007, 12:33 PM
Natural Whey over Instant Whey of course ;)

Crash
27-09-2007, 02:09 PM
Thank you for the responses.

LewisJ thank you for reminding me of mixing dextrose with my shakes. This is something I used to do, and forget why I stopped really, this will defianetly be brought back.

In refrence to drinking the shake prior to training (will be a stomach test on certain sessions I imagine) is this now generally agreed to be optimal?
I thought from reading (albeit nearly 3 years since I really tried to comprehend this myself) that the 30-45 minutes post training was more optimal as the body is in a heightened state and looking for nutrients. Is this a point of debate still? does the optimal time difer dependent on activity? Anymore information on this subject is greatly appreciated.

sports-select, keeping the pre-mixed shake refrigerated is not an option as it would entail leaving it at home and therefore due to travelling mean I would not get it straight after training. I value you're opinion though, and will therefore stick to taking the shake in powder form to training and mix it there. Even if this means taking flavourless myprotein gunk to the gym to neck afterwards.

What is the difference between concentrate and isolate?
Sorry if this is simple, I am not up to date or very knowledgable past the understanding of whey protein, quick and easy, good for after (or now before :s) training.

HardcoreSportsTraining, are you referring to this product from reflex:
http://www.reflex-nutrition.com/sports_nutrition/muscle__size/document_9_2.php
What is the advantage of this product over the regular reflex instant whey? or the myprotein product with no flavours or sweetners?

Thank you guys for your support, anybody else's opinions are still very much appreciated.
Sam,

Alex Gold
27-09-2007, 02:38 PM
HardcoreSportsTraining, are you referring to this product from reflex:
http://www.reflex-nutrition.com/sports_nutrition/muscle__size/document_9_2.php

Yep


What is the advantage of this product over the regular reflex instant whey?

It's not full of artificial flavourings or sweetners


or the myprotein product with no flavours or sweetners?

It's more likely to be decent quality protein, regularly tested etc.....I dunno, to me saving an extra few pence on a products that costs 40p a serving isn't top priority when you get a better product.

Sports-Select.co.uk
27-09-2007, 03:05 PM
Isolate V Concentrate is an age old debate, with both having advantages and disadvantages and ddrawing roughly equal over all. Since Conc is cheaper go with concentrate.

Having spoken to Reflex on the isue of pre mixed shakes, they said it will be good for upto 8 hours in a fridge (though it might change colour!), but rapidly goes south at room temp.

nomad
27-09-2007, 03:08 PM
FRAT.


stick to egg whites and milk.

genesis
27-09-2007, 03:20 PM
im using myprotein hurricane xs at the minute its exactly the same as cyclone but miles cheaper, tastes nice too

Crash
27-09-2007, 03:24 PM
Thank you sports select, concentrate it is then. I have since posting read a couple of brief explanations of isolate v concentrate, and appreciate that it is a debated subject - so I think the value aspect is most important and will go with concentrate.

Thank you also for Reflex's stance on the pre-mixed shakes. I will avoid ever doing this.

HardcoreSportsTraining, I appreciate where you are coming from with the natural whey product but am personally not overly concerned about artificial falvourings and so forth. Maybe I should be more so, I will go away and read some more horror stories on them. It has been a while since my last read.

Regardless, I am curious about the price difference (no artificial colourings at the same price would seem like an obvious choice.) Where do you get this product from? and for how much? Is there much of a difference in taste to the regular instant whey product from reflex?

Crash
27-09-2007, 03:30 PM
Thank you Genesis, I had not spotted this product on the website. This is certainly something to consider, I am leaning more towards a pure whey product due to the price issue, but the price of this product does make it potentially accessible even upon returning to being a broken-ass bum.

How have your gains been since using this product? Would you say that it has helped you reach your goals?

LewisJ
27-09-2007, 03:33 PM
In refrence to drinking the shake prior to training (will be a stomach test on certain sessions I imagine) is this now generally agreed to be optimal?
I thought from reading (albeit nearly 3 years since I really tried to comprehend this myself) that the 30-45 minutes post training was more optimal as the body is in a heightened state and looking for nutrients. Is this a point of debate still? does the optimal time difer dependent on activity? Anymore information on this subject is greatly appreciated.


(will be a stomach test on certain sessions I imagine)

Yeah thats something you'll just have to test out yourself. I have no problems with it for any session. 15-20 g protein + 30 g dextrose 10 mins befoer training. By the time you've warmed up most of it will have left your stomach.


is this now generally agreed to be optimal?

There are a few studies that show this. The theory is that taking it before exercise allows time for the protein to digest and be absorbed into the blood so that the amino acids are available at a time when sensitivity is increased. Adding dextrose will further increase the insulin response, which increases amino acid uptake. Also exercise increases muscle blood flow, increasing amino acid delivery to the muscles. for more info see

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez

basically amino acid uptake was 2.5 times greater when taken immediately before resistance exercise compared to immediately after. Other types of exercise haven't been studied, but i would think the response would be fairly similar.


30-45 minutes post training was more optimal as the body is in a heightened state and looking for nutrients

It is compared to 2-3 hours after exercise, but doesn't seem to be vs before exercise.

There is lots of ongoing research in the area.

Best uptodate review in the area is

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=14971434&ordinalpos=33&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsP anel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

hope that helps

Lewis

Alex Gold
27-09-2007, 03:36 PM
Regardless, I am curious about the price difference (no artificial colourings at the same price would seem like an obvious choice.) Where do you get this product from? and for how much? Is there much of a difference in taste to the regular instant whey product from reflex?
I got it on special order from Sports Select. Tastes a little less sweet, but that's a good thing IMO

Crash
28-09-2007, 09:53 AM
Thank you for the links lewisj, is there someway to get the full papers off of that site? I could only figure out how to read the abstracts. Sorry if I'm being dumb.

HardcoreSportsTraining, how much did the natural whey cost you? Is it much more than the instant whey?

Alex Gold
28-09-2007, 09:57 AM
I think it costs the same

LewisJ
28-09-2007, 11:09 AM
What uni do you go to? Check at the library if they do a sports science course you should be able to get the 2nd paper at least as its in the journal of sports sciences.

Just seen the link for the first paper is wrong. It should be.

http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/sites/entrez?Db=pubmed&Cmd=ShowDetailView&TermToSearch=11440894&ordinalpos=18&itool=EntrezSystem2.PEntrez.Pubmed.Pubmed_ResultsP anel.Pubmed_RVDocSum

Al Wallace
14-05-2008, 08:37 AM
I'm gonna give reflex protein a try I think. I need something to take for the couple of weeks or so I have to come off the MyProtein Hurricane, with me only needing to take it for a couple of weeks I can spend a bit more cash and I'm gonna try the reflex stuff out for a bit

Crash
15-05-2008, 11:39 AM
I have now tried both MyProtein whey and Reflex and I would say I haven't noticed a huge difference between them. Reflex tastes a lot better, but that is superficial when compared to the difference in price.

The biggest positive I have experienced is that with the cash I saved buying from MyProtein, I bought a tub of glutamine and I believe that this has helped reduce soreness and therefore allowed me to train more frequently (without whinging that I was still sore.)

I wouldn't say don't try it though, reflex is a quality product and it will serve its purpose to fill the time between cycles of Hurricane. How have you found Hurricane?

Sports-Select.co.uk
15-05-2008, 12:15 PM
Reflex now do a 4.4kg bargain bag which helps to narrow the price gap a bit:
http://www.supplement-select.co.uk/whey_protein/reflex_instant_whey_4_4kg_bag.htm

Al Wallace
15-05-2008, 01:11 PM
I have now tried both MyProtein whey and Reflex and I would say I haven't noticed a huge difference between them. Reflex tastes a lot better, but that is superficial when compared to the difference in price.

The biggest positive I have experienced is that with the cash I saved buying from MyProtein, I bought a tub of glutamine and I believe that this has helped reduce soreness and therefore allowed me to train more frequently (without whinging that I was still sore.)

I wouldn't say don't try it though, reflex is a quality product and it will serve its purpose to fill the time between cycles of Hurricane. How have you found Hurricane?

I think hurricane is great, I take it twice a day and am happy with the results. As far as value for money is concerned I'd be impressed if anyone can better it