Warning on your mortgage...

[stapesmk1]

For those of you looking at getting a 1st mortgage, next mortgage or re-mortgaging can I please offer the following advice.............


AVOID PLATFORM MORTGAGES LIKE THE PLAGUE!!!!!!!!!!!!!

If your mortgage adviser suggests a deal through this lender, or you come across a Platform deal yourself, DO NOT, I repeat DO NOT get mixed up with this complete set of incompetant, self rightious, ignorant set of scum bags.

They do not want to lend and will have you jumping through hoops for upto 6 months, signing and re-signing the same documents, each time promising that there will be no further requests made of you, only to ask for you to sign the exact same document time and again until they are happy with it.


Un-fucking believable.

I am so glad Im leaving mortgages.

I have a poor couple who have been waiting for their re-mortgage since March and desperately need the extra money they are raising.

Platform Mortgages= Total set of wankers.

Stapes

[Leigh]

Cheers for the warning. Just remortgaged and got another to do in January

[Rob Hannis]

If you don't need to remortgage right now ride it out as long as possible, rates are coming back down to more realistic levels so hang fire. Additionally check what your lenders variable rate is, a lot of people will be on a prefferential rate, such as Alliance and Leicester customers from about 2 years ago coming onto a tracker at 5.99% with no ties so you can wait it out until something better comes along.

I never used platform for any of my clients, they once quoted me 10% when another lender would do it at sub 6% so guess which one we went for?

[TTDKing]

I'm looking at mortgages at the moment as a first time buyer and haven't got a fucking clue what to go for or where to even start. Well i know i'm not gonna go for that platform mortgage so thats a start.

[Josh Palmer]

Probably remortgaging one of my places in the next 6-10 months, hopefully it won't be too bad by then.

Trying to buy any additional places in this area is a damn nightmare though, even before the dip.

[DetoxGuru.com]

are they a company ? or a type of mortgage??

[Rob Hannis]

It's getting better so hold off as long as you can. As a ftb (ttdking) best to save up as much deposit as you can, have a look at mform.co.uk to look what your typical payments will be. Then say payments are £500 a month look at saving that ammount (£500) each month so you know you can manage along with some budget for bills etc. If you are renting etc then adjust it accordingly.

If you still need advice ask stapes, I'm currently out of the industry so although I can give you general advice I can't advise on current deals etc.

[Rob T]

Why would a mortgage lender not want to lend to you? How would they benefit from making you jump through hoops?

[stapesmk1]

Platform are a mortgage lender Detox.

Lenders only want to lend in a buoyant market. In a turbulent market like the one we are in now, lenders seek to reduce their exposure to risk across the board. Like in any walk of life, lending is a risk (like that £50 you lent uncle knobhead 3 christmas' ago) and although there are contracts and legal documents in place to best protect the lenders' interests (not yours!) a lender is not guarunteed to get their money back (hence the position in the U.S.).

In terms of risk, a lender looks at a myriad of factors, everything from how much of a risk the client is-clients age, time in employment, income etc; to how much of a risk the property is-details of the tenancy, details of the property, ie. a 2 bed terrace is less risky than a leasehold flat above a shop, as the terrace would be easier to sell on if repossessed.

Aswell as the property and the client being viewed as risks, the loan amount and loan-to-value (LTV) ratio is assessed as a risk.

Demanding a larger deposit (eg 25%) means that they are only exposing themselves to a limited amount of risk and are demanding that you invest a large amount to share the burdern of risk. The 100% LTV and 125% LTV mortgages of the last 2 years, coupled with lending to just about every man and his dog, regardless of past bad credit, has exposed lenders to massive massive risks and led to huge losses for many lenders.

While your prime lenders (highstreet, mainstream ie Halifax, Abbey, Alliance & Leicester) have the strength to still trade, many of the sub-prime lenders (such as SPML, Kensington, Future, Scarborough, TMB) have had to withdraw from the market for the time being until they can trade again or have gone completely bust.


Apologies if Im telling people what they already know, but after the day Ive had today I thought it might be an idea to give you guys a heads up if you are looking to get a mortgage at the moment.

All lenders, both prime and sub prime have restricted their lending during this "credit crunch" by making the criteria you have to satisfy to be approved much tighter, thus less risk to them.

Some lenders have been open and honest and told advisers like myself that they simply do not want to lend and have raised their rates so high, that they have priced themselves out of the market. GMAC have been honest enough about this.

Other lenders are not so honest and are still hawking for business yet using underhanded tricks and delaying tactics so they don't have to turn business away and can instead keep their clients strung along for months on end, all the while seeing what other lenders and the market in general is doing.

Platform have been absolutely 100% completely out of order with my clients and Ive had a similar experience with 2 of my Abbey cases. Platform have been quite bullish and pedantic about demanding things, then deciding that those things arent needed, only to demand further things from my client over and over again.

Abbey have just been ludicrously incompetent on 4 or 5 levels. Platform have been scoundrels.

Rant over.

Any questions, gimme a shout.

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUCCCCCKKKKKKK!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Stapes

[DetoxGuru.com]

we all need a good rant from time to time mate :)

[stapesmk1]

we all need a good rant from time to time mate :)

I really could have done a Michael Douglas today mate. Honest to God. Ive got to phone my clients at half 7 to explain.

Shit...........

Stapes

[DetoxGuru.com]

haha go into macdonalds and order a breakfast at 1031 am , classic micheal douglas

[stapesmk1]

haha go into macdonalds and order a breakfast at 1031 am , classic micheal douglas

Think they'll be getting a mortgage application in the morning from Mr and Mrs A & T Hrax!!!!

Bwahahahaha.

Stapes

[madhorsebjj]

I've got a question. I'm thinking about getting a mortgage but I only have about £800 a month to spend. What value properties could I get at that price over a ten or twenty year period?

And do you think prices will continue to fall in the sales sector.

[Shaolin Exile]

I can't understand why mortgages got so complicated. When I took mine out there were simple repayment mortgages and endowment mortgages (based on a with or without profits life insurance). I had two endowment mortgages

When I moved and took out my second mortage an independent financial insurance convinced me to take out a with profits life insuarance policy to cover the capital to save money. Not anticipating Black Monday he assured me I would have no problem accruing enough profits to pay the capital off at the end. He was wrong. I have of course made necessary adjustments but if I'd stuck with a life assurance with a guaranteed sum without profits I'd have had no problems at all. ...so why didn't they stick with that model as mis-selling shouldn't have been an issue?

[brawler4life]

stapes your a smart guy diet and mortgages

[Rob T]

I can't understand why mortgages got so complicated. When I took mine out there were simple repayment mortgages and endowment mortgages (based on a with or without profits life insurance). I had two endowment mortgages

When I moved and took out my second mortage an independent financial insurance convinced me to take out a with profits life insuarance policy to cover the capital to save money. Not anticipating Black Monday he assured me I would have no problem accruing enough profits to pay the capital off at the end. He was wrong. I have of course made necessary adjustments but if I'd stuck with a life assurance with a guaranteed sum without profits I'd have had no problems at all. ...so why didn't they stick with that model as mis-selling shouldn't have been an issue?

They were probably making more commission on WPs, that's what it usually comes down to.

[david5]

same story with auto finance at the moment stapes

[Rob Hannis]

They were probably making more commission on WPs, that's what it usually comes down to.

Exactly, advisers weren't paid comission for selling the mortgage then, normally only earnt from the endowment, so what did they sell? Interest only and an endownment. Add in the fact rates were higher it meant lower payments so an easier sale, with little mention that the endowmwnt might not cover the mortgage.

Now they have to be clear on who pays them what so you can make a more informed choice, although there are still dodgy advisors out there, more get banned every week so hopefully the industry is cleaning up.

[Shaolin Exile]

You can make an informed choice if you understand what you're being told. When I reorganised my mortagage repayments to make up for the shortfall, I hadn't a clue about what I was being sold (other than it covered the costs at a price I could afford...which was basically all I cared about at the time)

[stapesmk1]

I can't understand why mortgages got so complicated. When I took mine out there were simple repayment mortgages and endowment mortgages (based on a with or without profits life insurance). I had two endowment mortgages

When I moved and took out my second mortage an independent financial insurance convinced me to take out a with profits life insuarance policy to cover the capital to save money. Not anticipating Black Monday he assured me I would have no problem accruing enough profits to pay the capital off at the end. He was wrong. I have of course made necessary adjustments but if I'd stuck with a life assurance with a guaranteed sum without profits I'd have had no problems at all. ...so why didn't they stick with that model as mis-selling shouldn't have been an issue?


A) Because the commisions paid for the endowments were more than what the mortgage lender paid in commission. Same story now with life insurance. Dont get me wrong, life insurance should be standard if you have a wife and/or family, but not really needed if you live alone. The life insurance company's commisions is way more than the mortgage lenders.

B) Easier to sell and interest only mortgage to a customer who is driven soley by the cost of the monthly payments. Interest only payments are lower as they are made up only of the interest part, thus easier to sell to people who are naive.

I would still go for an interest only mortgage which allows you to make cash overpayments (typically upto 10% of the balance per year). If your mortgage was £500pm on repayment and £350 on interest only, put £150 away into a high interest notice or deposit account. They typically give you high interest for 12 months, then every 12 months move your money into a different high interest account, much the same as people transfer their credit card balances to benefit from 0% periods.

That way, as long as can trust yourself and you exert discipline you can pay your mortgage off early or pay it off and have a lumo sum. Means your money works for you and you have more control over how quickly the balance is paid off.

Fixed rate mortgages especially are "front loaded" which means during the years you benefit from the fixed rate, you pay very little off the balance anyway. Then towards the end of your term its mostly the balance you are paying off plus the interest.

At the moment I would look for a base rate tracker or SVR deal with no tie ins (no early repayment charges) and minimal arrangement or booking fees. The fixed rates are just too high at the moment. Id take it out interest only and invest like Ive mentioned. Or take out an ISA.

David5: So finance houses are pulling the same tricks in with car finance and dragging it out?

Stapes

[stapesmk1]

I've got a question. I'm thinking about getting a mortgage but I only have about £800 a month to spend. What value properties could I get at that price over a ten or twenty year period?

And do you think prices will continue to fall in the sales sector.

No offence mate, but you might as well ask me how long is a piece of string. Don't worry, I get it a lot though, people think its so simple and its far from it.

I couldnt possible give you any advice based on that limited amount of information and in fact it would be illegal.

Im retraining in accountancy at the moment (right now actually, so cant be on here too long...) so I couldnt really advise you. But I can put you in touch with an impartial adviser. (Have to say impartial now as "independant" is now a no no and fraught with legalities).

Anyone giving you advice would have to take quite a few pieces of information off you first so that they can see which deals you qualify for first and then advise you on the best ones for you.

You might think you have £800 a month to spend, but your income will have to be assessed against FSA guidleines and that will enable a lender to say what you can afford a month or what they are allowed to lend you.

Its a bit like chicken and the egg. I can't start with £800pm and find you a deal. Its the other way round.

Id assess your circumstances and I would find out what lenders would lend to you, what their maximum loan to you would be, how much deposit you would require and on what types of property.

When I knew who you as a borrower qualify with, I could compare the deals you have access to and look for one that is around £800 per month.

Do you see what I mean? Thats how we'd arrive at it. Its not as easy as just having a monthly payment in mind and going getting it, you have to see what is available to you. Each mortgage is awarded on an individual basis and the mortgages you have access to may be different to what your mate can get for a whole number of reasons.


If anyone is looking at getting a mortgage at the minute, you DEFINATELY need a large deposit, of between 10 and 25% before Id even consider it. THis can be in the form of equity in your home if you are remortgaging.

And no, house prices look set to fall at least until March 2009. Great time to buy if you can qualify for a mortgage. First part of the sector that will pick up is the buy to let market, as landlords pick up cheap houses coupled with BTL mortgages being the 1st ones to relax criteria slightly and be more readily available.

Stapes

[stapesmk1]

stapes your a smart guy diet and mortgages

Ta pal. Accountancy next............

Stapes

[david5]

yeh, small minority are being bastards. everyone is harder to egt placed, and even if they're accepted, finance houses are finding any petty thing with customers proofs or the docs to reject payout

[Emmet J]

I think not enough people take responsibility for doing their own research into mortgages before getting one.

Going into a mortgage advisor and saying "I've got £600 a month to spare, what's the best deal I can get?" is like going up to a car salesman and saying "I've got £16,000, what's the best car I can get?" If the car saleman said "Do you want alloys? They make the car go faster!" or "Shall we install our GPS system? You won't find one cheaper and they're essential these days!" You would like to be able to know that he was talking bullshit and confidently say "no." Some mortgage advisors do the same bullshitting sales pitches but because people have no idea what they are hearing they just go "yeah, if you think we need that we'll get it."

When I got my first mortgage sorted out about 18 months ago I spent a lot of time doing the legwork, seeing a whole bunch of advisors (for free), learning the jargon and checking different rates and lenders against one another before I committed to anything; so now I can sit comfortably in my lovely house (still in positive equity) and say "fuck the credit crunch, I planned ahead and did it properly, so I don't have to worry."

[Andy K]

It's fairly common sense imho ensure you can afford the house you are in, dont go crazy on the payements. At this stage however i dont really think anyone can say fuck the credit crunch as it may only just be begining

[stapesmk1]

I think not enough people take responsibility for doing their own research into mortgages before getting one.

Going into a mortgage advisor and saying "I've got £600 a month to spare, what's the best deal I can get?" is like going up to a car salesman and saying "I've got £16,000, what's the best car I can get?" If the car saleman said "Do you want alloys? They make the car go faster!" or "Shall we install our GPS system? You won't find one cheaper and they're essential these days!" You would like to be able to know that he was talking bullshit and confidently say "no." Some mortgage advisors do the same bullshitting sales pitches but because people have no idea what they are hearing they just go "yeah, if you think we need that we'll get it."

When I got my first mortgage sorted out about 18 months ago I spent a lot of time doing the legwork, seeing a whole bunch of advisors (for free), learning the jargon and checking different rates and lenders against one another before I committed to anything; so now I can sit comfortably in my lovely house (still in positive equity) and say "fuck the credit crunch, I planned ahead and did it properly, so I don't have to worry."

You did the right thing mate.

But its not so much the features of the mortgage you have to consider at first, its who you qualify for. the features are something to analyse and take advise on after your circumstances have been assessed. Really used to fuck me off when people would demand an on the spot quote and not want to divulge any details. Can you imagine walking into a hospital with a broken pelvis and saying "fix me, but im not telling you whats wrong".

People think they can just waltz in and get whatever mortgage they want. People moan that they need a deposit, well you wouldnt get a car or anything else that big of a commitment without one. Fuck, if I was lending someone money to buy a house Id wanna see them put their hand in their pocket to put some of the money up.

Then people say ,"fuck that, my mates mortgage only costs him £xxx a month and its a bigger house". Yeah well, he didnt have 3 CCJs and 12 missed payments in the last 18 months pal.

People need to get it into their heads, they arent going purchasing a mortgage. A mortgage isnt a product you can walk into a shop and pick up. Mortgages are awarded on merit. They have criteria to meet. It makes sense. You're not buying anything from them, they are giving you money.

People need to find out what they qualify for before they start talking numbers and stuff. That comes afterwards. They need to realise that their circumstances are theirs, not anyone elses, so its about what they qualify for, not what they want in an ideal world.

Stapes

[Emmet J]

It's fairly common sense imho ensure you can afford the house you are in, dont go crazy on the payements. At this stage however i dont really think anyone can say fuck the credit crunch as it may only just be begining

I see what you're saying regarding the crunch, but otherwise I'm not sure I agree; you see to be assuming that most people have this 'common sense' thingy majig.

[Emmet J]

A mortgage isnt a product you can walk into a shop and pick up. Mortgages are awarded on merit. They have criteria to meet.

I still wind my wife up because she needs more qualifications for what she does and gets paid more to me, but when we went to get our mortage I counted as a 'professional' and she only got 'skilled worker."

[Andy K]

lol true, i suppose its a general lack of common sense that initiated the whole credit crunch scenario.

[Emmet J]

lol true, i suppose its a general lack of common sense that initiated the whole credit crunch scenario.

Even people who normally have a fair deal of common sense still do stupid shit because they are told to by someone that they believe is an 'expert' on the subject.

That's the history of humanity in a nutshell unfortunately.

[stapesmk1]

Even people who normally have a fair deal of common sense still do stupid shit because they are told to by someone that they believe is an 'expert' on the subject.

That's the history of humanity in a nutshell unfortunately.

Im just glad im coming out of it. Im really not a customer service kinda person. I accept that people are coming for advice on something they arent experts on or dont have a clue about. But when they come with pre-made assumptions and try to act as if they know what theyre on about or try to make it out as if you're trying to rip them off then that pissed me off.

There was definately a time when rogue advisers were raking it in and being right cunts, but not everyones like that. And regulation from the government now is so strict. I had the pleasure of an FSA random visit earlier this year. You really have to prove all the way through a file why that deal was the best for the client and justify yourself at every single step. Some of their questioning and busy bodying goes beyond common sense and is anal and totally does not help the client.

People can be real dumb. I learnt that being a lifeguard, then had it underlined in red as a doorman.

Persons can be smart, people are fuckin idiots.

Stapes