On the whole, is it 'easier' to move up the belt ranks in Judo than in BJJ?
Is there as much to take in as there is in BJJ?
Assuming you're not training in a McDojo and you're being taught your Judo by a credible coach?
I would say yes, it is easier to progress through the belts in judo. A lot easier infact.
And no disrespect to judo, But there is nowhere near as much to take in as there is in BJJ. Judo is mainly standup, very little groundwork at all. A top black belt in judo would still struggle against a good white belt in BJJ, if fighting on the ground.
Having good judo will help loads in BJJ tho!
MRSimon are you retarded or a troll?? Of course the ground game is not as developed in judo because of the rule set; just as the stand-up is not as developed within BJJ, because of the contest rules; doesn't make either sport more developed than the other; they are just different.
The black belt is not seen as the ultimate goal with judo; you can have recreational black belts and then competitive black belts and then you can have domestic, International and Elite world class fighters all at black belt level. Contest results are the main aim for serious judoka.
To answer the question yes the black belt is easier to obtain within judo; it does not mean that judo is easier; at International contest level B level tournaments such as the Belgium Open will have over 100 professional fighters within each weight category! You wil not see that in BJJ even in Brazil.
I like the difficulty of obtaining a black bekt in BJJ; and actually I am ashamed at the level of some judo black belts in both stand-up and ground game; however one negative to this is the seemingly constant chasing of belts in bjj; every other thread I see lists some guy chasing his blue or purple or whatever; belts are only good for one thing... tying your gi up.
Last edited by jcraig80; 25-12-2009 at 11:53 AM.
that was a good informative post from a judoka perspective..
hope to start some judo in the new year and looking forward to it..
progressing through the belts in judo is easier because there are far more belts and in judo the belts go way higher then black.
BJJ Black Belt
jcraig makes some excellent observations.
My own perspective of the meaning of the Black Belt in the 2 arts is this-
Judo 1st Dan= You have mastered the basics thoroughly.
BJJ Black Belt= You are an Expert in the art.
Many International Judoka stay at 1st Dan during their competitive careers
because they don't care about gradings or belts and they concentrate solely on competition results.Upon their retirement from competition they begin grading again.
Why are some Judo black belts not at the level they should be, McDojos'?
Originally Posted by jcraig80
BJJ Black Belt
I don't think the term 'Mcdojo' can't really be applied to Judo.Judo isn't trendy enough or expensive enough to really market as a 'Mcdojo'.
In my experience 'Mcdojo's' are all about the satin trousers and a grading syllabus made up by the Owner/Instructor of the gym who is usually a
1st Dan or Brown Belt in a Karate System and has made up his own style of
'Kickboxing' and has graded himself up to be an 8th Dan Master.
I think a very good way of judging if somewhere is a Mcdojo in the true sense of the word, (and there are plenty of other ways but we are straying from the subject) ,is=
Do the grades you earn at the Mcdojo/gym mean anything in any other gym.
I.E. If you earn a WTF Taekwondo Black Belt you can wear that belt in any other WTF TKD Dojo in the world.
Same with a Shotokan Karate Black Belt.
Same with a BJA Judo Black Belt.
Same with a BJJ Black Belt.
If you earn a Black Belt in *Zen Ryu Gung Fu Kick Boxing Freestyle* where can you wear that belt.Probably only in the Zen Ryu Dojo somewhere in a small town in England.That is a Mcdojo.
Back to Judo-
The easiest way i can explain the huge differential in skill between different
Judo 1st Dan's is to explain this-
The 1st Dan is available to everyone.If you turn up to class regularly,train hard and go to gradings eventually it is possible to gain a Black Belt.It may take a long time but you will get there,even if you are not particularly talented at the sport.You do your time,keep turning up and over time (unless you are absolutely rubbish) you will eventually gain enough points for your 1st Dan.
The reason this is hard for BJJ guys to comprehend is that in BJJ some guys will never get a Blue no matter how hard they train.And others will never get a Purple no matter how hard they train.Because to get the next belt you have to be able to beat guys of that belt.And not everyone is going to be able to get there either mentally or physically or both.The reason there is such a huge drop out in BJJ is because guys who start very quickly work this out and if they really think they won't ever get the next the belt they give up.
That's fine,it's just jiu jitsu,it's just the way it is.
On the contrary,in Judo there is always light at the end of the tunnel and
even a guy who doubts his own ability can see that eventually he could get to Black Belt.
Please let us remember though that the Judo 1st Dan is not a certificate of excellence in the sport,as i mentioned earlier,it is a certificate of mastering the basics.
There is also a way of gaining 1st Dan in Judo that set's a player apart from the guys who eventually get there by commitment,resliliance and hard work even though they are not naturally talented.
The coveted way of achieving the Black Belt,that every Judoka would secretly (or some openly) be very proud of is by line up.
This is when during a grading the player beats 5 Brown Belts by Ippon (the last 3 in a non-stop sequence without rest.)
This fast tracks the player to Black Belt and means he doesn't have to wait to gain his 100 points over time.(Every Ippon at a grading score's 10 points).
I have heard stories of Judoka getting to 90 points on their grading cards then 'losing' the card so they don't gain their Dan Grade by points,instead choosing to delay the promotion in the hope they can eventually achieve it by line-up.
BJJ Black Belt
Although some Judo 1st Dans may have difficulty with a good BJJ White Belt on the ground,there are other Judo 1st Dan's who could tap BJJ Black Belts.
It all depends how much Ne-Waza the Judoka trains.
When i was a White Belt in BJJ i saw a Judo 1st Dan tap out a heavier,in competition shape BJJ Black Belt.The Judoka was a Ne-Waza specialist.
One thing i can say though,is be careful about disrespecting Judo 1st Dans
because remember that us BJJ guys only start from our knee's in training,
in competition you start on your feet and even the most rubbish Judo 1st Dan would throw a BJJ White Belt on his head.And if that encounter doesn't happen at a competition or a Dojo,but in a street encounter that throw could cause death.Anyone who thinks i am maybe going a little over the top has never been thrown for ippon by a guy who has deliberately not rolled out of the throw to be kind,but has instead put his full force into it.