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Thread: Is Amateur MMA actually MMA ?

  1. #1

    Default Is Amateur MMA actually MMA ?

    This is really just food for thought and to get people's opinions and in no way is being disrespectful to anyone that choses to fight under these rules.


    Amateur MMA - as in the type of amateur MMA rules we have here in the UK - ie no head shots, etc:

    Q 1: Is there any point to it?

    Q2: Should it be called MMA?



    Personally speaking i don't see the point in amateur 'MMA' rules without head-shots as this is pretty much a separate, watered down sport altogether. I don't know if these sorts of rules were just invented by the folk that prefer grappling or wrestling, but to trade off the back of MMA is a little bit misleading if you ask me.

    I have been to numerous shows whereby the casual 'UFC' fan has bought their ticket and went along to something billed as 'cage fighting' or Mixed Martial Arts, and then they see a handful of undercard amateur bouts that resembles more of a wrestling or grappling match than what they are used to 'on the TV'. Cue the "what's this crap" comments..

    If we use the major promotions as prime examples: UFC/Strikeforce/Pride the one thing they have is consistency and that is consistency in their rules. Pro rules. Fans buy a ticket and see a product that they are used to.


    As i said at the start, not taking anything away from those that compete under 'Amateur MMA' rules as it is a hard sport and anyone that competes deserves the respect for what they do, but realistically speaking, why don't those that don't want head contact form their own 'brand' and compete in that instead of trading off the back of the MMA name?

    By allowing this watered down version to be put onto the same shows as pro rules, aren't we doing more damage than good when it comes to promoting the sport to 'the wider audience'? (by that i mean the casual fan, not just fighter's friends & family, etc)

    Be interested to hear people's thought.

    Regards

  2. #2
    Senior Member Brett's Avatar
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    I think it does class as MMA, though it's more Pankration (which i guess was the earliest form of MMA anyway)

    I think it's a bit of a cop out when proper shows are padding the card with no headshots fights though, if i had paid to go to an MMA show, this isn't what i'd want to see

    There's definitely a place for no headshots MMA though and things like Combat Sports, Grapple & Strike, UK MMA league etc are the places to do it. they're shows/competions arranged specifically for these rules so the competitors and spectators are under no illusions about what they're going to get

    I've done 9 no headshots mma 'fights' and really enjoyed them as i enjoyed training but couldn't really commit to a proper MMA fight due to work commitments so it was a good way for me to supplement my grappling competitions

    you have to remember that a lot of very good fighters started off with the no headshots stuff, Sol Gilbert, Zelg, Jenkins, Kelly, Reedy, Marshman etc it's a good introduction to the sport. some people may try the no headshots stuff n think getting hit isn't for them and just stick to grappling, some may get the bug for it and go on to the higher levels.

    to summarise, there's definitely a place for no headshots MMA, but it should be at the right time at the right place

  3. #3

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    ECFF love AMT MMA. Just watch my show to see some great fights and great a skill level.
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  4. #4

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    Quote Originally Posted by Brett View Post
    I think it does class as MMA, though it's more Pankration (which i guess was the earliest form of MMA anyway)
    "Pankration (play /pæn.ˈkreɪti.ɒn/ or /pæŋˈkreɪʃən/) was a martial art introduced into the Greek Olympic Games in 648 BC and founded as a blend of boxing and wrestling but with almost no rules save disallowing biting and gouging the opponent's eyes out."

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  5. #5
    Senior Member Brett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Jay View Post
    "Pankration (play /pæn.ˈkreɪti.ɒn/ or /pæŋˈkreɪʃən/) was a martial art introduced into the Greek Olympic Games in 648 BC and founded as a blend of boxing and wrestling but with almost no rules save disallowing biting and gouging the opponent's eyes out."

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    Lol to that definition I agree they're miles apart. However the sport evolved massively over the years and the in modern times pankration bouts have hardly resembled the blood bath that definition would imply

  6. #6
    Senior Member Rob T's Avatar
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    I've fought no head shots and although it's called amateur MMA I don't consider it MMA.

    Fair few UK shows now using American amateur rules though; 8oz gloves, no elbows, no heelhooks. Much better ruleset imo.
    http://www.ChrisReesAcademy.com - http://thetattooedchimp.blogspot.co.uk/

  7. #7
    Senior Member Brett's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rob T View Post
    I've fought no head shots and although it's called amateur MMA I don't consider it MMA.

    Fair few UK shows now using American amateur rules though; 8oz gloves, no elbows, no heelhooks. Much better ruleset imo.
    I've heard the term 'combat grappling' used to define the no headshots Mma, I think it's probably a better term for it than MMA

    I agree that's a better rule set but it would take new entrants into the sport a lot longer to reach a level where they could compete in the NSAC amateur style fights, I see no problem in people gaining experience under the current ammy rules first

  8. #8

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    Could have sworn it was 649 B.C, just to be picky!

  9. #9
    Senior Member Rob T's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Brett View Post
    I agree that's a better rule set but it would take new entrants into the sport a lot longer to reach a level where they could compete in the NSAC amateur style fights
    That would be a positive outcome. Loads of people start fighting way too soon.

    Boxers and Thai guys don't do no headshots fights first, they get used to sparring in the gym before they fight.
    http://www.ChrisReesAcademy.com - http://thetattooedchimp.blogspot.co.uk/

  10. #10
    Slightly Bonkers shakus maximus's Avatar
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    nearly all my guys have started with am rules.
    imo it is mma as it involves striking, wrestling and Jiujitsu
    there is a place in mma for all levels
    It is a great stepping stone and allows fighters to compete without the pressure of getting ko'd early in their career.
    all bar 1 of my pro team have competed with no headshots
    it does not create bad habits as long as you are training and drilling pro rules in the gym
    current pro fighters from Wales & england who have not done badly by taking the am/semi then pro route are
    Ronnie Mann
    Joe Duffy
    Tim Newman
    Jack Marshman
    Martin Mr Pink McDonough
    Ryan Phelps
    James Saville
    Paul Reed
    Denniston Sutherland

    just to name a few

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