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Thread: Artem Katov - Harrop fight now No Contest

  1. #71

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    My final thoughts on the matter - If the situation is that that the promoter was less than truthful about the weight of the opponent, then that sucks for Lloyd. He's a lightweight anyway, taking a fight at welterweight. From the pictures provided, it seems like the promoter knew that Katov was over 77, and didn't tell Lloyd. That's not really fair.

    The question is: What did Katov weigh in at? Did he weigh in the day before, on the day, or at all? It's been said that Katov was weighed after the fight - After the fight, of course he is going to be much heavier. He's clearly got a wrestling background, so it's not unreasonable to think that he'd be able to cut a decent amount then put a good percentage of that back on by fight time. It's what he weighed before that matters, and of that we have no proof.

    From a strictly rules point of view I agree with Jay, there's nothing on paper that says this should be a no contest. Because there is no proof of what Katov weighed in at, we have no way of knowing that he was overweight (or both parties didn't agree to whatever he was) beforehand. I've asked a very well respected official for their take on it and it comes down to this - without video footage, there is no real way to prove that Katov weighed in heavy. All we have is the word of the promoter, who the fighter/manager themselves have accused of being economical with the truth. Lets be honest guys, we all know that dodgy stuff goes on with weight on a far too regular basis - half the results on Sherdog could end up being NC's and that's a dangerous precedent to set. Unfortunately without a commission, that's the world we live in.

    This whole situation should really serve as a lesson to all involved, promoters, managers and fighters. Promoters: Make sure there is a video weigh-in to cover you. Most importantly be honest, because when people feel aggrieved, in this digital age it's very easy to get information out to the public, as we have seen. Fighters/Managers/Coaches: Don't accept a fight unless you have seen video evidence, or are satisfied with the weight before hand. Promoters should not be lying to fighters about an opponents weight, but this is far, far from a perfect world - If you agree to a fight, it behooves you to be certain of what you'e agreeing to before you do so.

    I know a number of people have spoken to the promoter about this, but we've yet to hear his side of the story directly. I'm not BakedBean (sorry folks), so I'm not about to invite him to this thread to answer my questions. It would be good to hear from him in the interest of fairness, but it seems unlikely at this point and I don't have the time or inclination to go chasing people at the moment. For me, that's pretty much the end of the matter.
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  2. #72
    Senior Member Evzy's Avatar
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    Has anyone said what Katov weighed in at pre fight yet or is the moaning that he weighed more post fight - which surely is understandable? Did anyone see Katov weigh in pre fight at 77? this doesnt seem to have been addressed yet?
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  3. #73
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    On the commentary at around 1.52 Ian Butlin states that Lloyd weighed in the day BEFORE at 76kgs... So did he weigh on the sacles AFTER the fight with Artem as well?

    Most WW are around 82-87kg come fight time

  4. #74

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    Quote Originally Posted by brashleyholland View Post
    My final thoughts on the matter - If the situation is that that the promoter was less than truthful about the weight of the opponent, then that sucks for Lloyd. He's a lightweight anyway, taking a fight at welterweight. From the pictures provided, it seems like the promoter knew that Katov was over 77, and didn't tell Lloyd. That's not really fair.

    The question is: What did Katov weigh in at? Did he weigh in the day before, on the day, or at all? It's been said that Katov was weighed after the fight - After the fight, of course he is going to be much heavier. He's clearly got a wrestling background, so it's not unreasonable to think that he'd be able to cut a decent amount then put a good percentage of that back on by fight time. It's what he weighed before that matters, and of that we have no proof.

    From a strictly rules point of view I agree with Jay, there's nothing on paper that says this should be a no contest. Because there is no proof of what Katov weighed in at, we have no way of knowing that he was overweight (or both parties didn't agree to whatever he was) beforehand. I've asked a very well respected official for their take on it and it comes down to this - without video footage, there is no real way to prove that Katov weighed in heavy. All we have is the word of the promoter, who the fighter/manager themselves have accused of being economical with the truth. Lets be honest guys, we all know that dodgy stuff goes on with weight on a far too regular basis - half the results on Sherdog could end up being NC's and that's a dangerous precedent to set. Unfortunately without a commission, that's the world we live in.

    This whole situation should really serve as a lesson to all involved, promoters, managers and fighters. Promoters: Make sure there is a video weigh-in to cover you. Most importantly be honest, because when people feel aggrieved, in this digital age it's very easy to get information out to the public, as we have seen. Fighters/Managers/Coaches: Don't accept a fight unless you have seen video evidence, or are satisfied with the weight before hand. Promoters should not be lying to fighters about an opponents weight, but this is far, far from a perfect world - If you agree to a fight, it behooves you to be certain of what you'e agreeing to before you do so.

    I know a number of people have spoken to the promoter about this, but we've yet to hear his side of the story directly. I'm not BakedBean (sorry folks), so I'm not about to invite him to this thread to answer my questions. It would be good to hear from him in the interest of fairness, but it seems unlikely at this point and I don't have the time or inclination to go chasing people at the moment. For me, that's pretty much the end of the matter.
    Good post. That about sums it up. No matter what the consensus or forum opinon, they go off the promoter's word which was given to them in the prior e-mails etc. As Brad says, now it's more of a word of warning and guideline for people to be more vigilant.

    I had a guy pull out the day before a fight after I'd sold a fair amount of tickets and a late replacement was drafted in and not weighed. Under the circumstances I was just happy to fight and was reaosnably happy that I could tell it wasn't a heavyweight, and that was that as far as I was concerned. It's not good practice though, and there's take home lessons here.

  5. #75
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    Glad that the truth has come out the we have'nt tried to darken anyone's name we were happy with the no contest due to the reasons stated the only reason we have had to come out fighting is because someone questioned the no contest and then people were contacting the UCC and they denied ever contacting sherdog when we knew different.

    Thanks to jay furness for getting to the bottom of it and as we said the truth would come out and it has so the promotor,rob riley & brad conway have lied to try cover up this screw job by denying that any deception ever took place there integrity is laughable it's opened a huge can of worms a governing body need's to be set up asap to over see,stop and discipline these very type of situation's if I happend in boxing there would be fined,banned or taken off duty etc . . .

    But we are glad that the truth has come out and we want to draw a line under this now and move forward just hope that fighter's take notice and learn from this situation and don't leave themselves open to these sort of things in the future a few people have said that this is the first time that they are aware of a time where a fighter has been lied to about a last second replacements weight.

    I joined this forum just to put our side across because we were made out to be liar's when we knew that was'nt the case anyway il leave it at that

  6. #76
    Senior Member Evzy's Avatar
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    The Truth, you still havent told us what Katov weighed in at pre fight?

    Somehow I fear he was legit weight and this is all smoke and mirrors now, because after several pages you still havent addressed that?

    If he did weigh in pre fight over and you were not told fair enough, however, if he was on weight pre fight, then this should not have been turned into a NC.
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  7. #77

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    Quote Originally Posted by Evzy View Post
    The Truth, you still havent told us what Katov weighed in at pre fight?
    This is the whole point of the thread - nobody knows what he weighed in at pre-fight, except, presumably, the fighter himself and whoever watched him on the scales. We don't even know if he weighed in at all.
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  8. #78
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    The promotor admitted AFTER the fight that kotov was 7-8kg heavier BEFORE the fight but told Lloyd he was 77kg because he "did'nt want to do his head in"

  9. #79

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    Quote Originally Posted by Ben CQ View Post
    You reffed that fight in particular I seem to remember.
    indeed i did

  10. #80
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    Like I've said someone please show me pics of kotov weighing in and facing off against Lloyd nobody can because they dont exist

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